After McCain’s choice of Sarah Palin as VP and the Republican National Convention, John McCain’s numbers went up six percent, mostly because he gained a TON of support from independent voters, and even won over quite a few Democrats.
Here’s my theory: Before the Sarah Palin nonsense, Barack Obama’s campaign had all the hype, all the glamor, all the excitement. Sarah Palin brings those things to the McCain campaign, which had previously been a non-story about an old white dude who’s run for this office countless times before. The convention also gave the campaign numerous chances to showcase the adorable Palin kids and the gorgeous McCain women.
Americans want to understand and care about the issues, sure, but, more than that, they want EXCITEMENT and BEAUTY.
Now the McCain camp can deliver those things. I’m beginning to think this Sarah Palin thing might have been secretly a brilliant move on McCain’s part. Never overestimate the intelligence of the American voter!
Did you change your mind about McCain after the RNC? If so, why?
Ugh. I am so upset by this. Sarah Palin’s policies are dangerous for women. She wants to overturn Roe Vs. Wade. She wants to the government to ban certain books in the library. In her state, she cited librarians and got one fired after they refuse to remove certain books from their shelves, as they regarded her move as unconstitutional. She wants to bring Creationism into public education. NO NO NO! She is many steps backwards from this already backwards state of American affairs. Please do not glamorize her in any way Beet!
If this is a motivator – Sarah Palin chases wolves, mooses, and other wild animals by helicopter until they expire from exhaustion, and then she shoots them and poses with them… isn’t any one of these atrocities enough for any rational, educated American enough to absolutely despise her?
I don’t know what the big deal is…. There’s always a bush or pussy in office anyways…. what makes this different?
More like, you can never UNDERestimate the intelligence of American voters.
Political analysts keep reassuring us that people vote for the person on the TOP of the ticket. Fingers crossed.
i’m not sure i buy the excitement theory, but i’m personally banking on their boredom factor. she’s as down-home small-town as you can find, and they brilliantly attacked barack on that front (especially the line about trashing his ‘community service organization’ and the fact that hers required responsibility). if they were looking for a hey,-i’m-just-like-you pick, they found it. the seasoned army vet thing wasn’t too relatable, but pregnant daughters under hockey mother divided by scrappy ‘i fought the old boys’ claims equals voter trust somehow! check my math.
what a joke!
I read Oprah declared she would not have Palin as a guest before the elections,
although I can understand why
I really think she shot her Obama campaign foot,
as people may think of it as a fundamentalistic act
and misinterpret reasons and arguments
on republican behalf.
Good god, Alex, get your ‘facts’ from somewhere other than the Daily Kos, mkay?
It definitely changed my opinion – I’m no longer writing in ‘Zombie Reagan’.
Sarah Palin may be the antichrist.
She’s DEFINITELY a nightmare and if McCain gets elected I’m moving to New Zealand. Seriously. I can’t take another Republican in office.
It would be totally awesome if Sarah Palin fell in love with Dick Cheney and they killed themselves in some romantic suicide pact. That would be sweet.
It would also be awesome if Barack Obama won. Woo! O B A M A!!!
Exactly, tvf. For those of you who insist on spewing garbage before actually checking the FACTS, here. Your homework is done.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/157986
For crying out loud, LEARN before you spew.
f*cking scares me
pl americans, don’t vote for those two… :(
I think this is lame, but not unexpected. Heaven forbid we vote for the candidate that actual has a political stance we can believe in… why bother, when we can vote for DRAMA? WOO.
The sad thing is that so many people are getting their information from blogs (no offense, Beet) or, like, fucking YouTube… we’re doomed either way, really.
Um, are you kidding? Newsweek sucks. I get mine from Harpers, LA Times, NPR. This isn’t new news by the way. It’s pretty much common knowledge. Thanks for playing. Try again.
My mind was changed after the RNC. I went from respecting McCain and his campaign, to having ZERO respect.
She is full of shit… Aside from the fact that I don’t agree with her stances on most issues, all of the crap she said in her speech at the convention was misleading, from the Bridge to Nowhere issue, the private jet on Ebay, and the personal chef. I really hope Americans are smart enough to see through this bullshit. It’s really very insulting that they thought this would work.
She’s a joke and so is this election. I can’t believe people could be so easily swayed by this blatant and cheap attempt to gain votes.
By the way – it’s hard not to get excited when we’re talking about another potential 8 years with a couple of dipshits who still talk to the general American public like they are 8 year olds.
Here are some facts: Alaska does not have taxes to cut, so she can’t take credit for this sort of thing, it doesn’t even exist in Alaska; SP took a town of about 6,700 with no debt, to a town with $22 million in debt; you can go watch her commissioning new ‘ministers’ and hear for yourself her understanding of God, her state of Alaska and our country – and God’s role in all of these things – you can judge for yourselves whether you agree or not.
No one should be held accountable for the preaching of their minister (Obama) or their church (JFK/Roman Catholics; SP/Assemblies of God) but we absolutely need to be held accountable for what WE say. She says things that are very scary, for me to hear. You might disagree. She is all over YouTube saying all kinds of things and not just sound bites, whole speeches.
As for Roe v. Wade, she is clear: no abortion for any reason, ever. Period. And yes, the conservative right intends to undo Roe v. Wade and if you do not know that, you don’t read, watch, listen to the news.
Her speech was well delivered, even if she was snarky and unkind; but make no mistake, she did not write one word of it. Not one. She is now, right now, being groomed for her role as McCain’s running mate and she will train well – she is a good actress and smart. Not fit to be the President of the world’s greatest nation, however and she wants to be one heart beat away.
Being Governor of a state with a budget smaller than the budget of Fairfax county Virginia, a state with less than 3/4 a million people, a state smaller than almost every capitol city in every other state, means almost nothing. And oh, Governors do not direct the National Guard to do anything outside their states, when they are called to go to Iraq for instance, the Governors have nothing to do with that – but don’t take my word, wiki it, google it.
She got her FIRST passport ever in 2007 and don’t start banging on about how she doesn’t need to go anywhere to be a good leader. That is just nonsense, we are a world leader and our leader’s need to be knowledgeable and well travelled.
And one last thing, she is a huge traveler to Washington, DC to get ear-marked money for Alaska – and that “bridge to no-where” she loves to sound so tough on, well, go ahead and read for yourselves; she wanted, lobbied for it, got the money, people got pissed, she got worried, didn’t build the bridge and kept the money. Yes, those are my words, but that is the story. Fact.
McCain wasn’t so scary til her. Now, he is down right terrifying. And Cindy is pissed off jealous…..that’s your juicey gossip, Beet!!!! Cindy is not going to take this lightly…..”soul mate”??????
I just don’t like anyone that wants to tap a wildlife reserve for oil.
Hmmmm….who should I vote for? Black guy or White girl????
If Palin gets to office there will be no more war. All the world leaders will sit in a giant circle, hold hands and talk about their feelings. “Ahkmed you didn’t raise your hand before speaking…you get a time out!”
But if Obama gets to office all the police officers will pimp their ride and the police will do drive by shootings while yellin “EAT IT BITCH!”….that’d be sweet.
If Palin got into office there’d be homemade muffins made from scratch and the presidential bathroom would smell like potpouri.
But then again if Obama gets elected there’d be a KFC on every corner and an unlimited supply of Kool-Aid but the bathrooms would smell like shit and there’d be cum stains on the sink.
With Palin the Cooking channel and Nick At Night would be on all white house t.v.’s for 8 years.
Obama….. BET and Soul Train.
Palin would raise taxes.
Obama woud raise the roof.
Palin would need more bodyguards and guns.
Obama would bust a cap in your ass himself.
With Palin… women have rights.
With Obama…bitches aint shit but hoes and tricks.
Tough choices to make on serious issues. I don’t know how you guys do it!
My opinion changed. I didn’t like McCain much to begin with, but now I completely hate him…and I usually do not hate anyone. She is the antichrist.
Palin is scary, just b/c she is a MILF and a woman doesn’t mean we should vote for her b/c her views suck
Tss. If you are really this miserable, get help. There is help for you, no matter where you live or what your financial limitations or even your age. But, dude, you need help.
Everyone, TSS comes on here as a cry for help. Never forget that about him. We all ask for help in different ways. This is his.
Eh. There is usually a bounce after a convention. Throw in a hot “hockey mom” who can throw down, and some of these independents and going to say, “WOW!”
Will they still be saying “WOW!” when they see that a vote for McCain is a vote for four more years of Bush?
If she cannot handle a press interview, how is she going to handle the Vice Presidency? I’d like to see her actually “speak” on her own behalf, rather than read a well-written speech dripping in adolescent sarcasm (and no, People magazine does NOT count.)
@ meerkat: I received that email about the list of books that Palin supposedly wanted banned. You are right, that list is bunch of LIES! There is NO way Palin thumbed her way through Chaucer’s Canterbury Tales. However, I believe you are missing the point. As stated in your Newsweek article:
Book Banning:
“It’s true that Palin did raise the issue with Mary Ellen Emmons, Wasilla’s librarian, on at least two occasions, three in some versions.” (Hmmmm…just like she continually raised the issue of firing her ex-brother-in-law.)
“The librarian was fired, but was told only that Palin felt she didn’t support her.”
(Hmmmmmm…..re: Trooper-gate…is there a pattern forming here?)
“Palin asked general questions about what Emmons would say if Palin requested that a book be banned…Palin described her questions to Emmons as ‘rhetorical’…[a]ctually, true rhetorical questions have implied answers (e.g., “Who do you think you are?”)”
(So she agrees, her questions to the librarian about banning books were not really “questions” so much as they were orders with a rhetorical twist. She then fired that librarian for her lack of “support”…that’s cute.)
Stupid question time – if the entire right is so incredibly hell-bent on killing Roe v Wade, how has it survived the last eight years? How did it survive the twelve years of Reagan/Bush 41?
It’s one of those things that’s just not gonna happen, because you’ve got a small majority that will always want Roe v Wade in place, social cons be damned. Unless you start advocating judicial legislation, which is a position I’d be very wary of. I know many many people here were cheering when the California Supreme Court legalized gay marriage, but watch out if that same judicial attitude of “we know what’s best for the constituency, who cares what anyone has voted for” gets turned on to Roe v Wade. The same argument of equal protection under the law that was used to push gay marriage can also be used to push fetal rights.
I’m just sayin, be careful what you wish for.
And re troopergate – I hope she used every bit of executive pull she had to get her brother-in-law fired. If I had an in-law that threatened my sister and my father, and tased my nephew, he’d be lucky I didn’t KILL him. And that goes double for most Alaskan women.
@Gabriela – Good point…. but someone please send Sarah Palin to hunt me down and shoot me like a wild animal if I use a celebrity gossip blog to cry out for help. Just sayin’.
I’ll probably vote for Mccain.
I don’t like either candidate, but barack’s policies will affect me more negatively in the future than mccains will.
And with a brother in the marines who is overseas, i don’t think the troops should be pulled out, and neither does he. I support my family.
Dudes, TSS comes on here because he’s bored and we’re all easy targets. Just because someone is mean to you on the internet doesn’t mean that they’re in the midst of a mental breakdown, begging for help. It’s means that IT IS EASIER TO BE MEAN TO PEOPLE ONLINE THAN IN REAL LIFE. Suck it up.
@tvf: yes, the law be damned! That’s worked well for the past 8 years.
sorry but no one gives a shit about abortion. If you think it matters you are fooling yourself, either side. As tvf stated 8 hellish years of bush (not to mention reagan and bush sr.) didn’t do anything to roe v. wade. No one cares about abortion. Stop clinging onto moot points and focus on real issues. Its legal… it’s not gonna change. Deal with it….. I’m talking to you pro-choicers! You got your way it’s legal. Big fucking deal. Non-issue anymore no matter what the extreme-rightist say. It’s all a huge red herring. Yeah…yeah I got it… supreme court judges… yada yada. Still RED HERRING Y’ALL!!!!! No supreme court judge is ever gonna overturn it. Get over it and bask in the glory of having your choice!
I went from supporting McCain if he won (despite the fact that’s he is not my #1 choice) to not being able to support him at all. I can’t take the Republican party acting like the vast majority are idiots anymore!!
You have got to be kidding. Anyone with an ounce of sense will not vote for Palin. One merely has to look into her record to learn just how much she has mislead the public in the past two weeks. McCain may have stirred up interest, but in the final analysis, he will look like quite the fool when more facts come to light. We have friends that live in Alaska, and she is NOT who she has represented herself to be in this campaign.
Regarding just a few of her views: Her extremist pro-life stance even if the female is a young teenager who was raped, is mind boggling. Add her push to have abstinence-until-marriage education taught in public schools, and you have a person who is seriously not playing with a full deck.
to Gabriela:
You are 99% correct. Palin also increased State budget spending by 23% during her first year as governor, and increased taxes. She gave businesses a tax break, yet raised taxes for individuals. There is one area where you are incorrect: Palin would permit abortion if the pregnancy threatens the woman’s life.
even though im to young to vote
i think mccain is sooo bogus
i mean he elected sarah just for the votes
which is exactly what hes getting
sarahs bullshit family is whats getting the votes for them
but besides the point
obama in my eyes is a much better choice
because his political views seem a litlle more realistic
and he could generally make this country get back on its feet
were paying for this stupid war
which were losing (in my opinoin)
and mccains probably going to push to keep this war going.
either way, this election is gonna be
probably the most excited election we’ve ever had
an african american could become president
and a women can be a vice president
which is good i suppose
Gimmeabreak: I hope voters of your POV are sincerely right in your assumption. Irregarless of the last few decades of bible beating conservatives threatening to reverse R v W, I think pro-choice voters should never feel overconfident and turn their backs on lawmaker or politician seeking to reverse this amendment. We should always feel outraged and actively fight this one down.
I’m not crying because TSS is mean to anyone. I personally thinks what he says he just plain weird.
Alex S – irregardless is not a word, and irregarless DEFINITELY isn’t a word. Newsweek may not be your favorite source for news but that entire article, if you had bothered to open it, is from factcheck.org. How about you read it and THEN form an opinion – you know, like any voter SHOULD.
No one is going to overturn R v W, regardless (see? that’s all the word you need) of whether or not they should. The reason Palin appeals to so many (which is obvious based on the polls) is that she believes abortion is wrong. She may not be able to do anything about it, but she appeals to those who share that sentiment. Not to mention the fact that she has actual leadership experience, versus “community organizing.”
I agree with Gabriela and Alex S…..
That TSS guy is insecure and just comes on this humorous celebrity blog in hopes that people will conform to his serious views so that he can feel important and sustain the self respect and attention that he lacks in his own miserable life.
Let’s make ourselves feel better by just ignoring him and go back to talking about political indignation and Lindsay Lohan’s tits.
Thank you Gabriela. Notice that the issues debated in that Newsweek article are some of the most minor ones to have been raised about Gov. Palin.
First of all, I don’t think there are too many politicians that are going to argue for a creationism only curriculum for public school children since so much of the population, conservative or liberal, is opposed to the idea of that. The idea she supports, IDC, however, teaches that evolution is 100% false. It isn’t an combo of ideas or a “mention that some people believe this” curriculum, it teaches 100% creationism. It seems to be in complete opposition to any idea of evolution at all. How could this be taught as fact in a school that gets federal money?
Also, she is a big supporter of abstinence only education. Regardless of one’s moral beliefs, this is a dangerous idea. To not teach students the dangers of unprotected sex or to treat the topic as some taboo, is just asking for them to come up with their own solutions to the issue. Abstinence only education assumes that every child has the moral belief that sex before marriage is bad and the only way to prevent unwanted pregnancies and disease is by not having sex. Everyone who has ever been in high school knows this doesn’t work. Alaska has some of the worst STD statistics in the country. I would prefer to let parents teach sexual morality and know students were learning how to protect their health at school.
She is also opposed a woman’s right to choose FOR ANY REASON including incest and rape.
She is also against stem-cell research of any kind…done, done, and done. Repubs/Dems/Independents all have many that support stem cell research to some degree!
In addition, Palin is constantly speaking on what a Maverick she is for going against washington insiders. It is true that she has done some great things for Alaska, but she certainly isn’t anti-earmark like she claims. McCain just ranted about how he will veto earmarks and make everyone aware of anyone who asks for one. They just raked Obama over the coals for accepting earmarks, however, Sarah Palin has accepted A LOT of them for Alaska 52 earmarks – $256 million in her first year…31 earmarks – $197 million so far this year. While mayor of Wasilla she accepted quite a bit of federal money as well. Obama and Biden have also accepted earmarks (many for non-profits), but Obama did agree to no longer accept any earmarks last year.
She has an awful environmental record and has stated she doesn’t believe global warming has been caused by anything we’re doing or she’s “not convinced.” I think GWB is even convinced at this point! She sued the Dept of the Interior when they listed the polar bear as endangered. Regardless of your feelings on polar bears, her reason is worrisome. Investigators claimed polar bears were becoming extinct due to shrinking ice. Palin thought this would hurt OIL AND GAS development in the state….so she’s willing to ignore scientific studies in order to continue with this addiction to oil and to gain her state money. Money that is pouring into Alaska (in her favor she is sharing with the citizens). She supports letting the average joe shoot packs of wolves from the air ONLY for the reason of allowing big game populations to increase OF COURSE to bring money into Alaska. She opposed a clean water act that prevented mining that would release toxins into the water making it dangerous for the entire surrounding ecosystem because it would bring money into the area. Does any of this sound like a pattern?
Regardless of whether she cut special needs funding, she supports school vouchers and vouchers have been proven ineffective and pull money from the schools that need it the most and the students that need it the most. In addition, McCain/Palin don’t seem to really care about NCLB and have said little about how they will change it. This definitely is in opposition to what is best for special needs children especially since this legislation is still seriously underfunded. In addition, it seems the ABC school system’s back to basics approach doesn’t do much for special needs children either since it focuses a great deal on phonics and spelling and other “basics” that have CLEARLY served the special needs community so well in the past.
The NRA has already claimed she’d be the most “pro-gun” vp EVER! Awesome!
Lets be honest, this lady is out of control conservative…she’s the last woman i would want to be the first woman in office and the only way ANYONE is being sexist about her is by how easy everyone is being about her and her family…if she was a man they would have ripped her apart…look at what happened with Biden today…oh poor thing, someone questioned her beliefs…that’s never happened in politics until now…those mean Dems!
Obama/Biden 08
Gabriela – you’re very smart and I approve your message. :-)
I was an Obama supporter but now after seeing
Palin and all the nasty shots she been taking has moved me toward her. For the first I think I’m going to vote Republican! WOW..
Lynn – you’re very smart and I approve your message, too. :-)
Oh and meerkat…I’m sure I have spelling mistakes and probably even grammar ones…so correct away…hopefully, correct spelling will fix all of our countries problems! I know correct spelling has certainly done more for the advancement of our country than community organizing. That’s a wack argument in general. Obama was an organizer before he even went to law school! AND since the goal of community organizers is to do what is best for the people they represent, maybe more politicians should have a little community organizing experience.
And tvf, the daily kos actually corrected the same things as your fact check article almost a week ago…so ,in this case, it would be a pretty good reference.
thanks Jo Jo! Great minds think alike!
McCain is the Anti-Christ!
The next president will most likely have the opportunity to appoint one, maybe two, supreme court justices. Do we want Scalia’s brand of constitutional interpretation to have a solid majority, maybe even 7-2? It’s not just Roe v. Wade that’s at stake (and I’m not willing to take anyone’s word that it won’t be overturned).
hey, while we’re posting interesting articles about the election here is one from Time. it is interesting to read the author’s breakdown of the hypothesis of how the candidate’s v.p. choices give a bit of insight into their characters.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1838571,00.html
according to gallup 50% of American women are pro-choice while 43% are pro-life. 37% of Americans consider it a major issue for them in the election while 49% consider it one of many issues they will consider. interesting. only 13% of americans stated that a candidate must have the same views as they do.
32% of republican women call themselves pro-choice, yet only 7% of Republican women are voting for obama. similarly, in contrast to the 37% of Democratic women who say they are pro-life, only 9% are voting for mccain. abortion is simply not a pivotal issue for these voters.
apparently the issue is even less of a priority for independent women voters. only 8% stated that a candidate had to have the same views on abortion.
there’s lots of room for swinging between pro-life democrats and pro-choice republicans. this is going to be a tight race and i still have absolutely no idea for whom i am going to vote. i’m holding out for the debates to make a final call.
Never forget that the “community” Obama organized had a larger population than the entire state of Alaska.
And. Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilot was a governor.
All ya all are so good. Really. This gossip blog gives me hope and I am not kidding here.
The Obama’s will make Americans proud to be Americans again. With grace and intelligence, real compassion and vast understanding, knowing the value of money through the work of their own hands.
@jk, excellent point and yet another thing to think about.
my head may explode. hasn’t some celebrity gotten violently drunk and forgotten her underwear recently? i need to turn off my brain again.
MY factcheck article? ROFL.
Manson was a community organizer too, and did a helluva job. A much better job than Obama, as a matter of fact, if you’re looking at actually getting things done.
Are you saying you’re ashamed to be an American, Gabriela? Because I won’t hesitate to question your patriotism :P
um, seriously, obama is no jesus. just sayin’. the last thing we need is another leader with a god complex.
lol tvf, lol.
This is so fun to read – nothing gets peoples blood rolling like politics and religion – and some of you guys keep trying to make it about both! I found it offensive that TSS started off his earliest comment with “black guy or white girl” – why are you making it about race or sex? And those aren’t really who you’ll be voting for as president. I guess it is kind of fun to post your opinions anonymously, yet surely none of you guys think you are going to change anyones opinions……
Sweet Jesus………. don’t piss it off tvf
Oh lord………….here it comes………don’t look directly at it.
I am UTTERLY convinced I’m going to turn everyone here into neocons, Texas Gal, otherwise why would I be here?!
ROFL!
waiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit for it……….
who am I waiting to get my shit jumped by, tss? Despite her politics being horribly misguided ;) , Beet is one of the more levelheaded gossip bloggers around. Otherwise, your ass would have been banned a long time ago.
And considering that Gabriela thinks that a major Biblical figure was the inspiration for the name of Jason Lee’s son, I’m not too worried about her either.
I was talking about big Gabby.
You think Beets reading this shit? She’s off getting laid which is why she posted about politics. She knows this crap will keep her “kids” busy. That’s why there hasn’t been a post for the last 4 hours.
But you KNOW big Gabby’s typin her ass off right now….
Hopefully Gabriela’s off getting laid too. I know I wish I was!
I dont read your blog to get your political views
so would you keep them out of it
i would be much more offended if i was american
thank god i am not
*yawn*
caitlin, we’re glad you’re not american too.
@ Lynn where have vouchers have been proven ineffective?
Damn Caitlin… that wasn’t very nice
Here’s an idea, Caitlin: if you see a post on politics, DON’T READ IT! I don’t give a shit about gossip girls, so I skip those posts. See how that works?
I doubt Beet’s going to completely abandon Lohan side boob for McCain side boob. Like Sarah Palin, we can have it all.
ewww, jk, mccain side boob image no burned into my mind. thanks!
Caitlin, I’d say this is a free speech issue, which is something Americans would understand better than whatever godforsaken Third World country you live in, but it’s not. It’s as simple as this: Beet’s employers see fit to pay her while she’s blogging about politics. As long as they continue to do that, it’s her place to do so.
And I agree with ribbet, we’re glad you’re not American too.
now, not no. i really can’t type today. sorry
I do believe that tvf is the smartest person to have ever posted on this site.
Well, yeah. Having Caribou Barbie as his running mate definitely improved McCain’s “numbers.”
Oh…that wasn’t yours?…I was completely under the impression you wrote the whole thing. I had no idea it was a nonpartisan organization. I’d never even heard of it and then i just assumed it was a blog. Thanks for informing me…I sure would feel silly!
or
I actually am rather informed like ALL VOTERS SHOULD BE…so much so that I knew, the Daily Kos actually already addressed this issue on the 4th…so when you told someone they shouldn’t get all their news from the Daily Kos, I just pointed out it seemed to be pretty factual about this particular issue…
But thanks for catching that mistake…it clearly changed my entire point :)
Oh my effing God. I love how everyone is going “Sarah Palin is the anti-Christ, I can’t vote for her” as if she is going to make any changes. Seriously, in this country, the President doesn’t make the rules by himself/herself, much less the VP. It’s not as if, if McCain gets elected, abortion would be banned, books would be burned, creationism (only) would be taught in schools, just because Sarah Palin may or may not believe in those things. Seriously, people. She doesn’t get to make the rules.
And I am so sick of people finding ONE issue (out of the million) and saying “I’m not voting for ____ because of _____”. Really? One issue? Is that the only issue that matters? (Roe v. Wade, for example) As long as Obama vows to not overturn that, you’ll vote for him, even if he increases taxes? Even if he thinks the Iraq situation is as simple as “get the troops out ASAP”? (By the way, I have a brother in the US Army and everyone in the service that I have EVER spoken to believes we still need to be in Iraq) I love how the Dems trash Palin for her “lack of experience” when Obama has the same problem, and he’s running for PRESIDENT. It’s not Obama vs. Palin, it’s Obama vs. McCain-if you want to compare the candidates, compare those two.
I am registered Independent, but I lean more to the right (it happens as you get older). I absolutely shudder at the thought of Obama becoming president.
I don’t believe that Sarah Palin is the anti-christ.
Although, how cool would it be if she was?
where are vouchers ineffective…pretty much nationally…drain money, cost billions, pull money from public schools. Above all, “competition” hasn’t really improved much of anything…
I had a voucher at the Waffle House for “buy 72 pacakes and get the next one free”………
that was pretty ineffective.
GO MCCAIN and PALIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My point was, Lynn, that I didn’t even post the link to the ‘factcheck’ article. So calling it mine is ludicrous.
EXCITEMENT….BEAUTY?????
Those women are all a bunch of botox fembots
I’m glad I didn’t get one of those “pancake” vouchers – or I’d be giving side boob shots. I love how you guys play with each other – make for some interesting reading while someone is off getting off….
McCain, more dirtbaggier, and senile that I thought before announcing a successionist (who, yanno wanted to secede from the Union of the US of A) and mother of a slut as a running mate. Kudos, douche!
Hell.No. She is a joke.
Would I do her in the bedroom? You bet.
Would I vote for her at the ballot? Hell, no. I know her history and her stands, and both of them dictate against me voting for her.
@Leigh:
Obama is not for immediately removing the troops. He acknowledges that it will take time. The Bush Administration invaded a country with no exit strategy, so whoever wins the presidency is stuck with a huge mess that will take many years to undo. Obama is not going to pull all the troops out immediately upon election and leave Iraq to crumble.
And I’m sick of the accusation that if you disagree with Bush/McCain, then you are anti-military, unpatriotic, and anti-American. I love my country, and I am horrified by how Bush has run this country into the ground. I have friends and family members who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan, and seeing the effect war has had on them is devastating. I think it’s patriotic to question the government when you disagree with what they are doing – that’s what “government by the people, for the people,” aka democracy is all about! If Bush was a Democrat, the Republicans would have been screaming for his impeachment years ago. They impeached Clinton over a BJ!
Just because someone is a Democrat or a liberal does not automatically make them immoral, anti-American baby killers. Sheesh.
I actaully think she is worse that Bush, which I didn’t think was possible.
Regarding this earlier comment: “As tvf stated 8 hellish years of bush (not to mention reagan and bush sr.) didn’t do anything to roe v. wade.”
Bush has appointed two justices to the supreme court; this has shifted the balance of power towards the conservative viewpoint, but hasn’t been enough to overturn Row v. Wade.
If elected, John McCain will likely appoint two or three more. He has already said that he wants Roe v. Wade overturned. Two or three more judges will be more than enough to do a tremendous amount of damage — not just related to the choice issue, but to many civil liberty issues.
“When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross.â€
— Sinclair Lewis
Oh Lord…I’ve tried to stay out of this, but I just can’t help myself…this time, I’m letting my hair down.
@The Beaver State: Beav’ – have you not noticed that that is the way the Right Wing operates??? They go for the jugular. Absolutely animalistic. They don’t care if they are spouting lies or making no sense whatsoever or defaming or committing libel. Contrary to what Republicans would have people think: Obama supporters are definitely more patriotic and extremely more moral than any Republican. Why? Because we care enough about this country to try to turn it around. We care enough about the people who are ACTUALLY alive to want to bring them home from Iraq or to want to implement social programs and progressive tax structures here at home to better their lives. We Demos aren’t as good at fighting dirty as the Repugs are (and no that is not a typo!) because it goes against our very nature. I am hoping and praying that the same snarky speech that Palin first delivered at the RNC and has since repeated ad nauseam will start to get on everyone’s nerves very soon. I can only hear that f*cking phrase “I said, ‘thanks but no thanks to that bridge to nowhere.'” one more time before I start projectile vomiting. I remain optimistic that the thinking, discerning, conscientious American will hold the power this time. And the thinking Americans are getting pretty damn freaking enraged and outraged about being held for complete morons by the McPalin ticket. I still have faith in those Americans who actually passed their SATs with a decent score, who might have ventured on to college for at least a year or two…yes, I am quite confident that the debates will help separate the wheat from the chaff and the discerning American will only be made more confident in his/her choice of Obama as president.
In the few threads that we have broached the subject of politics here I have tried to stay rational and levelheaded in my responses and have taken the time to explain my positions clearly. After reading some of the outrageous crap here all I can say is: If you vote for McCain you are a complete, hopeless and shameful moron. If you don’t believe me – Let me describe the typical McCain demographic: You are most likely less educated, more self-involved and self-absorbed, less able to think critically, less likely to have experienced other cultures or to have traveled abroad, are most probably monolingual, more likely to vote on gut reactions and feelings – (this palin bounce would not be there if she weren’t a handsome woman, of that I am certain) – you’re more likely to take only a superficial look at 1. the candidates and 2. their policies and 3. for that matter current events, in general, before casting your ballot. You most likely haven’t touched let alone read a “real” newspaper in a very long time. You most likely vote based on only one issue if any. You make your decisions based on such superficial things as “she’s a woman” “he’s a war hero” “my brother is in the army and he thinks we need to stay in iraq” or on what mom and dad told you to do. You have no clue how other governments function and most likely don’t even care about your own f*cking ingnorance.
This kind of voter/voting behavior is not only dangerous but exceptionally shameful and downright disgusting and yes, disgraceful!
Go right ahead and flame me if you want now! I don’t give a shit. I am tired of listening to the jughead playground bully types in here who can’t even spell or write a coherent sentence, let alone give a coherent reason or two why they would vote for McPalin.
If John McCain wins this election then it is only confirmation that we are a nation held hostage by you right wing, religious fanatic loonies who have no brains.
For your reading pleasure, I will attach a less inflamed post that I made in another thread. I challenge you McCain supporters to read through it and understand it and then to challenge what I’ve said. I’ll bet you can only come back at me with pissy, junior high type barbs, just like McPalin does.
*** (slightly edited)
In a “functioning†democracy we have an obligation to be well-informed before we vote. nd you’re saying that since the majority of Americans knows the same or less than you it’s ok because our democracy functions??? I wouldn’t necessarily call our government a “functioning†democracy – just look at the last two presidential elections that were highly controversial and fully fraudulent. Here we are brutally forcing democracy on people all over the world and we don’t even know how to function as one properly ourselves! You simply point out, when the majority of citizens approach voting the same way you do – based on impressions of individual personalities, based on the surface, on feelings- bragging about being un- or apolitical – that our democracy is a joke. Yeah, that’s not being a good citizen.
Our policy making machine is more or less controlled by big corporations at the moment. Is that a democracy? Sounds more like corporate facism to me, much akin to what went on in pre-war Germany. In fact, in the course I teach on the rise of Nazism and Racism in Germany from 1919 to 1945, I talk to my classes about how Hitler rose to power. Are you even aware of how that happened? Let me tell you that political apathy voting based on gut reactions among the citizens of that country fed right into his hand and aided and abetted his rise to power. That ought to send shivers down your spine. We do have a responsibility as citizens of a democracy to be well-informed. Period.
Really take some time and think deeply about the kind of nation you want to live in. What does it look like? Think about the cause and effect of poverty and wealth, war and peace, literacy and illiteracy, health care or no health care have on society, for example and try to piece together your own “utopia†if you will. Then read! Listen to different viewpoints, listen to NPR or read the NYtimes, or if you’re really lazy but do want to get informed watch “The Daily Show” every night!! Jon Stewart has a pretty damn good bullshit meter and he’s not afraid to use it!
Base your choices on real issues and real philosophies, but not on personality or relatability or God forbid on race. Be informed and be thoughtful. You owe it not only to yourself but to your fellow citizens.
The fear of being labeled a racist or not open minded if they do not vote or like that no talent ass clown Obama is hilarious!
It is great to see that some Americans seem to care enough about the upcomming election to actually know what is going on! Kudos to you guys.. No really.
I’m not an American, I live in Denmark which is pretty fucking far away. I’ll post my opinion on this anyway, because it so happens that whether you vote McCain or Obama will, in the end, somehow affect me and my country, America being a super power and so forth.
It seems that the majority of comments are pro Obama, most of them are even quite clever remarks! I hope that this goes for the majority of Americans in general (being pro Obama and clever (those to kind of stick together)) – because McCain and Palin in office would be some SCARY shit. Not just for you guys, but for the rest of the world as well.
So all of you guys that are voting Obama – thanks on behalf of my family, my friends and myself. Because the horrible past 8 years of Bush in office have affected the rest of the world as well.
No more republicans – please!
Well Ali, New Zealand will be waiting for you if a Republican does get nominated. You people are pathetic, both Democrats and Republicans alike, who promise to move to another country if their candidate of choice doesn’t get elected. So like I said, if Mccain is elected, GET THE FUCK OUT OF HERE! Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, will be stopping you.
Thanks, Ali. Many Americans in this country are finally waking up.
By the way, Gabriella, Palin left WAsilla with at $201 mil budget deficit — not $21 mil. And she slashed funding from the State’s budget that helped provide unwed, pregnant teenagers with housing and care centers. Apparently, she thinks this is the partents’ responsibility. Heartless — just heartless. I saw a video last night where she clearly stated in her church that our presence in Iraq is “God’s will.”
This woman is indeed frightening.
Oops…sorry Gabriella; typo there; I should wait for my morning coffee beofre typing. It was a $22 mil budget deficit for Wasilla. The $201 million is money that she stole from US taxpayers. She hired a professional lobbying firm to lobby for funding to finance building the “bridge to nowhere” in Alaska. When it became obvious that this was a terrible idea and political suicide, she came out against this project. However, she kept the $201 million Alaska received for the project. No wonder Alaskans love her.
@ jojo: being a young one myself, i’m around lots of people in the 18-25 demographic who are just as blind in their quest to endorse obama. i’ve got nothing against anything you said, but the whole time i couldn’t help wondering how many republicans are thinking the same thing about our liberal obamamania. a few late-night shows have done spots where the host asks people on the street about politics — namely, asking for one reason why people like barack. it’s embarrassing how little they know. liberals are surface voters just as much as anyone else.
@ Brynja: jeg har boede et halvt aar i koebenhavn for tyve aar siden og kan snakker lidt dansk. min soen var i sommer disse aar i roskilde til rockfestivalen! kan du en gang fortaler mennesker her hvorfor systemet i danmark med sykeforsikring og saa videre er godt? du kan bestemt ser (see?) her hvor bloede mange amerikaner er. det er riktig pinlig. (oh i’m not sure if i got that right in my last sentence – pinlig = embarrassing, right?)
well, I hope that is understandable. :-)
obama/biden ’08
“When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross.â€
– Sinclair Lewis
This sounds like Obama to me, the Messiah, the “Chosen One”.
I was going to vote for McCain anyway, because the mere thought of Obama in charge of anything in this country makes me sick. He may be a wonderful teleprompter reader, but he is an empty suit.
I don’t see how after what we’ve been through from Bush how ANYONE can even CONSIDER voting for McCain! When I watched the RNC I could only stomach an hour because everything coming out of their mouth was horseshit. And McCain sounds like a frail old man… let alone that that’s exactly what he is. He has to use Palin as his stategy because nothing he can offer this country will get him the vote… because, in a nutshell, all he’d offer is exactly what we’ve had for the last 8 years. I don’t agree with ANYTHING Palin has to say. I am terrified that they will get the vote from the same ignorant people that put Bush back in office for the second term. And this country will fall apart… more so than it has already! Only way to fix this country is to put Obama in office! Look at the facts guys! Look what
Clinton had done for us, and compare it to Bush… are you REALLY going to vote for a republican? All they care about is the rich. They are corrupt. They CHEATED Bush into office as well… REMEMBER THAT? I just don’t understand how people can even consider them for one tenth of a second!
I think TSS and tvf is the same person…
I think TSS is hilarious.
eyes of green, you have no clue! obama writes every one of his own speeches as opposed to mccain or sarah palin and mccain can’t even read from a fricking teleprompter! you’re frightened of obama because he uses words that have more than 2 syllables and you’re confused by his complex sentences. Well, I have news for you, if McCain/Palin win this thing then the lives of most Americans and most of the rest of the world unfortunately will take a turn for the worse.
I’m not a huge fan of either candidate, but I don’t understand how people can blast Palin for not having experience. She is not running for president. Obama is young and has no experience, but he is running for president. How does Obama’s lack of experience make him a fresh face not corrupted by Washington, but Palin’s lack of experience make her unfit to be vice president?
What do you mean he has “no” experience? What planet are you living on?
look, both candidates have to do what their party bosses say. for example, obama will never stand up to say the teacher unions to effectuate better classroom performance and mccain won’t stop his corporate sponsors from profiteering.
neither one of them is going to be able to”lead” the way they would want to and i really don’t think we’ll experience any significant change with either candidate because the system within which they have to operate will remain the same.
they will always have to answer to special interests because their asses have been bought and paid for. we just have to pick our poison: do we want to pay more taxes with an out of control federal government thenvote democrat? OR if you’d rather pay more for gas and everyday products because of run away corporations raping the general public for profit, then vote republican.
ribbet,
Well, congrats to you, because if you’re afraid you’re going to be paying more taxes under Obama then you must earn over $250,000 a year! And what do you mean by out of control government? Have you never heard of the Patriot Act??? WOW!
There is a real chance for real change to the good of everyday Americans if Obama wins, not alone because he is a brilliant visionary, but also because he would have a Congress that would support him.
@ ribbet: I respectfully disagree with you. While it’s true, neither of the candidates will be able to lead the way they would want to, I actually do think we’ll experience a significant change with a Democratic President, Congress, and Senate. After all, we did experience a significant change from the Clinton to the Bush years with the same system in place. Let’s reverse that, shall we?
@ jojo: i do and i’m proud of it. believe it or not it buys a hell of a lot less than it used to, thank you mister bush and your catering to the oil companies. i work damn hard for it and would like to keep as much of it as i can. i don’t see a problem with that, if you do, well you must make less! ;-)
seriously, i haven’t decided for whom i’m voting. the thought of paying elevated prices for everyday products AND more taxes (yeah more than the 40% i already for out) for programs that quite frankly i don’t receive a direct benefit of, is not at all appealing.
my point is that i believe that especially after the last 8 years, our political system is broken. i don’t think any one person can change the morass and corruption that occurs on such a grand level because they have to work within that system – no matter how well they deliver a speech or what neat t.v. ad they run.
neither party is truly looking to reform the system because it works for them. all this talk about change is just a lovely ad campaign. but really the candidates should wear labels like nascar that delineate their corporate sponsorship. it would make it easier for the general public to choose.
if you disagree, so be it. ranting at me about your candidate really just makes me want to vote the other way to be difficult about it and cancel you out. i’m bitchy like that! blessings.
fork out, not for out. i really should proof read.
@lah-dee-dah: here’s my deal, if hillary clinton were on the democratic ticket it would have been an absolute no brainer for me. she would have had my vote primarily for the reason that you cited. i think she ran bill’s presidency from behind the scenes and did a pretty damn good job. i think she and the team that she would have been able to assemble could have worked the best and getting through the mess of the last 8 years because she is a full throttle bitch and could bully her way through it all. i think she has a better head for economics and the fact that if you kill business, all you are doing is creating more work for social programs. however, she would never have catered to these corporations like we have seen bush do.
once again, before i get blasted, i am undecided for whom i am going to vote. i can rip equally on mccain/ palin as i am unimpressed by them.
but today i’m pondering obama.
i don’t know if obama has it in him to work through all the bullshit that has accumulated over the last 8 years to not only effectuate change but repair the system. i just don’t know.
i’m waiting for the debates before i make a final call.
oh that’s sad, ribbet. really. well, kudos to you on the big paycheck anyway. but voting out of defiance, c’mon? i am not ranting about my candidate, i am emphatic about the fact that people need to open their eyes. it is soooo frustrating to see people choose their government based on superficial and unimportant things. at any rate, i would venture to say that you are probably one of the few in this forum and in this country for that matter who earn that much money and what you said is simply not true…taxes won’t go up for that many people — only for people with incomes as high as yours, which is a very small portion of the american population, so it is not true for you to say things such as: “…do we want to pay more taxes with an out of control federal government then vote democrat? ”
because for the VAST majority of Americans Obama’s plan will lower taxes not make them pay more. i’m just sayin’…
it’s crazy. he nagged and nagged obama about being a celebrity and having the wrong kind of publicity, and now he got himself exactly the same thing. if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em. i guess.
jojo: i’m failing to see where i’m sad. and that seems a bit judgmental. but, oh well. if as you say, i’m guaranteed a tax increase under obama after already shelling out 40% of my hard earned income, how can my eyes be closed when i say that i’m not excited by that prospect and keep mccain in play? why wouldn’t i vote for the candidate that would keep my money in my pocket? it’s a strong consideration and frankly one that trumps the abortion issue in my mind.
having read your previous posts, all of them, i respect your view point and the fact that you believe a larger federal presence in our lives would add value. i respectfully disagree. i think local and state governments are leaner and meaner and add more value to their citizens’ lives. that said i would support a higher state/ local tax before i would an increase in federal programs that, once again, do not directly benefit me, my family or really community. we are clearly at different places in our lives. but with your rational, isn’t my vote all about me not the collective good?
that said, some of your posts have belittled the beliefs of others and are very pro-your way is really the only right way. everyone else needs to “open their eyes”. may i state that many of us have our eyes open, we just see a different landscape than you do.
the extremes of both parties have always bothered me. it’s their way or the highway – there’s no middle ground. it’s yet another reason why i think the system can’t be fixed. everyone is so busy being right that they don’t work or play well with the other children.
consequently, given my innate distrust of both parties’ agendas and the fact that i am a pro-choice woman who makes more money than a lot of folks, but a lot less than others, neither party is an option for me. unfortunately, i think there are a lot more people like me than you think – perhaps not on this site, but we exist. we are essentially disenfranchised in this process and generally, quietly resentful.
that said, i just don’t see either of the candidates that have been presented to us as having any real chance to effectuate the kind of change they are advertising and my vote will go to my perceived lesser of two evils.
@ jojo – Excuse me but I hardly think you can say I am SCARED of Nobama because he uses ‘big words’. If you’d take your head out of the sand (I’d really like to say ‘your ass’, but that would be crude) you’d see that ALL he does is talk. He has NO experience, he has accomplished NOTHING, he is trying to say he has so much experience because he has run a campaign for 18 months (ooooh, wow!) he’s nothing more than a windbag who talks of change but has no plan on how to change anything. He does plan to raise taxes, on business, oil, and people. So you are going to be paying his higher taxes no matter how much money you make, one way or the other.
I don’t care for your ‘if you don’t like/vote for Obama then you are stupid and need to open your eyes’ attitude. Believe it or not, we are all entitled to an opinion and a voice. One would think that your being a disciple of the Most Holy One, you’d have more tolerance for other points of view. You will not change anyone’s mind in favor of the Democratic party – you will make them turn from it.
And while so many people like to blame Bush, blame Bush, he’s the devil, blah blah, let us not forget that we have a Democratic controlled Congress that has a lower approval rating that our President does, and they need to share in the blame for how horrible you all think this country is. I am insulted by US citizens constantly bashing our country. Has anyone seen the pictures coming over from Cuba after the hurricanes? Those people are living in shoe boxes. We are still the best country on this planet. Maybe you need to open your own eyes to that! And just the fact that you have not had your door busted in and gotten hauled off for even speaking about politics should make you appreciate the USA even more.
Dear TSS and tvf,
I ♥ you. Threesome?
Love,
Mercy
Aww thanks Mercy, but I had a 3sum last night………two hot ass women……well one had just an ok face, but SLAMMIN body!
You should ask Gabriela and Jojo…. it sounds like they haven’t been laid since Clinton was in office………….hmmmmm…. things are starting to make sense!
TSS,
Sounds hot. However, I’m going to continue pining for you and tvf, because sarcasm turns me on.
Fondly,
Mercy
In case you were wondering how the different tax proposals would affect your income ribbet and others.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/11/news/economy/candidates_taxproposals_tpc/?postversion=2008061113
thanks jojo. i’ll read anything and consider all opinions before i decide. have a great day.